monks
New Member
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Post by monks on Oct 13, 2005 16:48:00 GMT -5
I feel like applying for an all-star arc, but I don't get how we're supposed to write it. Is it an 'ultimate' thing, where you can kind of refigure the characters? Because since this site is just starting up, I don't get how we're supposed to do any 'ultimate' stuff yet.
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Post by Admin on Oct 13, 2005 18:44:13 GMT -5
To me, "ultimate" is kind of an artificial concept. How exactly would one version be the ultimate version of a character or book (sort of presumptuous to say it in the first place, given the legendary stuff that has come before)?
It isn't the mission of the DC2 to produce "ultimate" versions. To put it in the most simplest terms, the DC2 is an alternate version of the DCU, giving us an opportunity to start with a fresh canvas, instead of one scribbled on for 60+ years (as brilliant as some of those scribblings may be). We have the opportunity to reimagine iconic characters (Captain Marvel and Green Lantern are the two major examples) where it makes good dramatic sense to do so, and never gratuitously (for the sake of the change itself--- like, for instance, making the Wizard Shazam female, as I've seen done in fan fiction, to somewhat baffling effect). Mostly, we will stick with traditional presentation, unless there is a good reason not to.
DC itself does this every so often, deeming it retrocative continuity; Crisis on Infinite Earths was the mother of all retcons!
If this doesn't answer your questions, please feel free to PM me, but you can also find the answers in the threads of the Welcome forums.
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Post by Brandon on Oct 13, 2005 18:58:16 GMT -5
Idlewilder has pretty much covered it but I wanted to throw in this example. I see this as comparable with the DC Animated Universe. We take the icons of the DCU and cherry pick the best parts of continuity and tell fun, baggage-free stories. Nobody's freaked out and killed the Green Latern Corps or has a water hand or been turned into a gorilla, well not yet at least.  This is sorta like the DC universe if Crisis on Infinite Earths, and all the reboots, retcons, and resurrections that followed, hadn't happened. But if you really want to see what's going on in the books then I encourage you to check out a few of our stories and see for yourself! Hope this helps! |
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evilal
Junior Member
Posts: 86
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Post by evilal on Oct 14, 2005 5:38:22 GMT -5
I think the confusion here has arisen out of the 'All-Star' title. This makes it look as though the book has something to do with DC's All Star range such as 'Batman and Robin the Boy Wonder,' which are in practice Ultimates-style re-imaginings.
This is not the case. I'm sure the editors will come back and confirm this, but All-Star here is simply a title for using heroes who do not yet have their own regular book on these boards. The name comes from the old golden [silver?] age book All Star Comics. It is not a range of Ultimate reimaginings of the characters. Though if you want to do that, presumably you could do an Elseworlds tale.
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Post by Admin on Oct 14, 2005 6:44:47 GMT -5
Exactly right, Al.
And thanks!
And KSM, that was a very apt comparison.
This should clear up all confusion.
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monks
New Member
Posts: 4
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Post by monks on Oct 15, 2005 17:18:42 GMT -5
Okay, that cleared it up for me. Thanks.
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ryu
Junior Member
Posts: 55
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Post by ryu on Nov 30, 2005 19:01:31 GMT -5
You know, I think DC comics should make a whole line of comics retelling the origins of the JSA, Batman, Green Arrow, Green Lantern, Flash(as in Barry Allen), and other heroes. What do you think
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Post by Brandon on Nov 30, 2005 22:35:08 GMT -5
You know, I think DC comics should make a whole line of comics retelling the origins of the JSA, Batman, Green Arrow, Green Lantern, Flash(as in Barry Allen), and other heroes. What do you think I think it's a great idea, Ryu. I was really hoping that the All-Star line of comics was going to be handled in that way. Like Marvel's Ultimates books in respects to a simplified continuity, but now it looks like it will just be a showcase for popular creators to go crazy with their particular visions. |
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Post by brigante133 on Dec 3, 2005 13:59:26 GMT -5
that was always the intent, they said that in all the press stuff that is was NOT a DC equivilant to the "ultimates" line. in fact, the whole ultimates line kinda bothers me because it basically says that THIS is the definitive spiderman and x men and you should just forget the last 40+ years of continuity becuase this one has prettier pictures and such. i think it is a slap in the face to the old creators yet Stan Lee is still out there pimping it out because he gets his name on it. it takes much more talent IMO to keep making characters that grow and develop rather then offer a shinier package with old stories.. DOWNGRADE to Ultimates.
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Post by Admin on Dec 3, 2005 14:02:33 GMT -5
Very good point!
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Post by Brandon on Dec 3, 2005 17:55:00 GMT -5
that was always the intent, they said that in all the press stuff that is was NOT a DC equivilant to the "ultimates" line. in fact, the whole ultimates line kinda bothers me because it basically says that THIS is the definitive spiderman and x men and you should just forget the last 40+ years of continuity becuase this one has prettier pictures and such. i think it is a slap in the face to the old creators yet Stan Lee is still out there pimping it out because he gets his name on it. it takes much more talent IMO to keep making characters that grow and develop rather then offer a shinier package with old stories.. DOWNGRADE to Ultimates. Yet they did say that the All-Stars would be a baggage-free continuity accessible to new readers, which was the original point of the Ultimates line. I don't read Marvel (except Whedon's X-men) but at the time I thought it sounded great and made sense. But by now they have make several "shocking" divergences from regular continuity, made many arbitrary changes to characters, and really developed a whole new complicated set of storylines to follow so I agree that project has really lost it's way. Plus, it's not like they stopped the 40+ year books, they are still there. Are you saying Ultimates is any more of a slap in the face to the original creators Jack Kirby and Steve Ditko then Marvel had delivered on them for pretty much their entire history? These creators have received almost zero credit for their amazing and revolutionary work at Marvel in the years following. They get WAY more respect from outsiders to the company. Sam Raimi had to insist that Ditko's name be included to the credits to the Spider-man movie! Don't believe me? Go looking for Jack's name in the credits to any of the other Marvel films. And don't make a sad case for Stan Lee. He gets paid over a million dollars a year just to be the front man for Marvel. I would say The Man is getting his dues. No, at the time with the movies about to start, a line of accessible books for new readers was one of the decisions that Marvel made that sounded right, but now they are little more than an excuse to have more Spider-man and X-men books to sell. I do think that both companies could really benefit though from having some type of format of books to market to mainstream venues to draw in new readership though. 'Cause right now, that ain't happening, all the new fans read manga. |
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Post by brigante133 on Dec 3, 2005 18:44:04 GMT -5
oh god tell me about it. over at barnes and noble or the library i cannot even look for comics (tpbs) without tripping over the hurdled masses of manga fans. i cannot really stand that medium anymore. either will eisner or frank miller said that manga are like comic book splash pages in every frame, take the story out and you get manga. maybe that's the appeal of it, the fact that all it is all fast paced action. i know this analogy maybe a stretch but its like comparing citizen kane to the fast and the furious. either way i think the whole manga craze is ridiculous and is destroying my faith in my generation of "artists" but whatever, i got laughed at in school for drawing green lantern... those bastards.
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Post by starlord on Dec 3, 2005 18:52:28 GMT -5
all the great one's got laughed at, at one point in there lives, Ramon. You are in great company.  and all I can say to KSM and Hory's comments is...you ain't whistlin' dixie guys! |
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Post by starlord on Dec 3, 2005 18:55:33 GMT -5
which to the younger set or those who didn't have great grandparents that came from West Virginia, means, "you're preaching to the choir."
which actually is another way of saying, "you are so right sir's!"
hmmm, well anyway...
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Post by Brandon on Dec 3, 2005 18:55:47 GMT -5
Well, a strong contingent in the manga audience are girls and I'd say they are drawn to the stories more than art (also being why there is a stronger showing of female fic writers over fan artists, but that changing a bit also with manga). For every DBZ there's a LOVE HINA. I believe the stories can be more grounded, angsty, and revolve around the various interpersonal relationships in some books. Plus there's the freakier and racier elements that bring in the slash folks. I also think the almost standardized art style in the manga books makes a predictable and stable element for the mainstream audience as well. In American comics every single book is different, but with the manga books you can usually count on what your getting ahead of time. That provides an attraction to some I think. Whatever it is, the Japanese are doing something right becase their comic industy is thriving. |
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Post by brigante133 on Dec 3, 2005 19:06:26 GMT -5
yes i forget the angst involved, thanks for bringing it up. honestly though, this stuff is really starting to irk me in a bad way. there is a lot that bothers me with it as an "artist" though as well. for the most part all this stuff looks the same, like you said its standardized. its like they are manufactoring a spirit of rebeliousness for all these people who go out and buy how to draw manga. the stuff has a formula! that really pisses me off. also to me the whole manga look is real sterile and there is no attitude in it, its all cookie cutter and there might as well be an assembly line working on each one because for all the exagerated faces and motions, to ME imo it has no soul.
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Post by deadshot042 on Jan 7, 2006 22:58:34 GMT -5
I was thinking of putting this idea up as a proposal and wanted to know if anyone was interseted. I was thinking of writing a DOOM Patrol story for the All Star line and depending on the public response, using it as a jumping off point for a monthly series. I started to write it and the ideas just kept coming. Anyone intersted?
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This is sorta like the DC universe if Crisis on Infinite Earths, and all the reboots, retcons, and resurrections that followed, hadn't happened. But if you really want to see what's going on in the books then I encourage you to check out a few of our stories and see for yourself! 
