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Post by Brandon on May 3, 2006 17:52:32 GMT -5
I was talking to Scott on the phone and realized that there's maybe a lot to be said on the subject (I know I can do an equal amount of praising and complaining on it) so I'm offering up a new thread for just that! The trilogies are over and many cartoons, media tie-ins, and a Holiday Special have turned up in the process. AND new projects are on the horizon with another animated series announced and the looming 100 episode television series in the distance so there's lots of life let in this franchise. I know when I attended Celebration 3 last year the fandom seemed to be in full effect and growing!
So, what are you thoughts?
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Post by Brandon on May 3, 2006 17:56:40 GMT -5
I'll start off by saying Phantom Menace was a totally unnecessary movie! It burned up a whole installment of the saga that could have been saved for showing more of the Clone Wars or Darth Vader putting the galaxy under his bootheel. Pfeh!
Coolest tie-in? Knights of the Old Republic baby! But the Clone Wars cartoons came pretty close I think.
The neat thing is seeing small kids still into this stuff. I saw the first movie at the Drive-In when I was five years old, but there are some kids on the next street over that pack around lightsabers and my two oldest daughters like renting the Ewoks cartoons from the library!
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Post by brigante133 on May 3, 2006 19:16:30 GMT -5
the phantom menace did one thing right. they got pepsi to pimp the heck out of it. I dont know if you remember but they had a really cool thing where 1 out of FOUR got a free 20 ounce under the cap. you know how much soda that summer brought me?!? thank you george lucas and pepsi... for the best summer of my life.
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 3, 2006 19:16:35 GMT -5
A great topic... Where to begin? I saw the original (not yet titled 'A New Hope') when I was three years old in dowtown San Bernardino. My memories of it are a little hazy, but they're there. My other fond memory of the time was going with my mom & grandma to the Broadway & seeing all the figures which were promptly scooped up by my loving family for me. That started it. ;D Then there was 'The Empire Strikes Back' once again in San Berdoo on opening day. Yoda figure bought for me by my mom in a new store called 'Mervyn's'. Then 'Return of the Jedi' with my ENTIRE family, again on opening day & getting the official movie magazine in the box office (those were the days!). And I don't care what anyone says I liked the Ewoks & thought ROTJ kicked serious ass! ;D A long gap, filled with Indiana Jones  movies & Star Trek movies  followed... but alas no Star Wars  ! Then word of a new Star Wars with a realy scary looking new 'Darth' and a young Obi Wan! I waited for HOURS for tickets. Opening Day of the Phantom Menace came. I watched it with the enthusiastic gleem of a little boy again, and I have to say... I loved it!  Until I saw it again. I was a little more level headed & less giddy... Then I saw it again in one of those digital theaters that boasted hi definition movie going... I couldn't tell the difference.  The Pod Race was 15 minutes too long. Yoda was NOT the Jedi that trained Obi Wan (so what if Yoda teaches everyone the art of lightsaber dueling! I thought the little green guy was Obi's teacher! there's that damn 'certain point of view' again!). The kid they found to play Anakin obviously didn't know how to act (little did we know it wasn't the kid, it was 'the creator' that had the directing issue). I could even stand Jar Jar's annoying ways more than listening to Viceroy Gunray & Mace Windu drone on like they were reading the script. The movies only saving graces were the lightsaber duel at the end and Palpatine's subtle political power grab. The Clerks cartoon had it nailed when Randall demanded his money back from George Lucas. Fast forward 3 years, here comes the promise of Clones! What? You mean the Stormtroopers were clones??? All this time, I had no idea! The clones were good guys? And they're Fett Clones! How cool is that? Again, hours were spent in line... toys were purchased (I'll post a few pics). Opening day arrived and I once again viewed it through the eyes of a child (maybe I should give those back...) and I loved it! It was the greatest thing ever in the history of cinema! There was a new cooler Fett that actually did more than just stand there looking menacing! There was a butt-load of Jedi! Clone troopers! Yoda's acrobatic dueling! Wow! Then I saw it again... and again...  Each time I got more & more pissed off. Not disappointed, just pissed! I've seen Hayden Christiansen in other movies & loved them (anyone see 'Life as a House? Great friggin' flick!). Who was this whiney little bastard that seemed to read his lines? I wanted Obi Wan to just chop off his legs then & get it over with! When did Natalie Portman forget how to act? Please grab your DVD's, put it on chapter 23 and let's all gag together! We live in a real world, come back to it! BARF! Glorious redemption came to the saga with the immaculately crafted Clone Wars ;D. My spirits were lifted! The future held hope! If only the Cartoon Network were producing the prequels all would be right with the world. As long as they don't give it the Justice League treatment. Here we go again. To say that I'm going into this a little skeptical is an understatement. If this one sucks, I'm driving to Northern California & personally open handedly bitch slapping George Lucas. I do not wait in line for hours to buy tickets. I do not wait in line for hours to get in.  I loved it! OK... so Hayden Christiansen is still over the top. But at least I didn't want to rip off my ears when he & Portman spoke to each other (with the exception of the who loves who more & why conversation that made me groan aloud in the theater). The effects, the duels (and there were a lot of them), the revelations, the massacre of the Jedi, Anakin dubbed Darth Vader before he wore the mask! And finally, at the end! The armor! I can overlook it's short comings & actually say that I still love this one! ;D It is no Empire Strikes Back, nor is it Return of the Jedi... but I will happily watch it before watching A New Hope, The Phantom Menace, or in my opinion, the most annoying of the prequels: The Attack of the Clones! Sorry for the rambling, but I can count the things I know a lot about on one hand & three of them are: Green Lantern, Legion of Super-Heroes & Star Wars... the other things I know, I rarely admit to anyone. Long story longer, I agree with Brandon, though I think AOTC was worse...       Yes, I am a geeky Star Wars guy! These are from July, it's gotten worse. |
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 3, 2006 19:18:05 GMT -5
the phantom menace did one thing right. they got pepsi to pimp the heck out of it. I dont know if you remember but they had a really cool thing where 1 out of FOUR got a free 20 ounce under the cap. you know how much soda that summer brought me?!? thank you george lucas and pepsi... for the best summer of my life. Snark! That was funny... I have those cans... You know you were secretly hoping to win the lifesize Jar Jar! |
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Post by brigante133 on May 3, 2006 20:14:21 GMT -5
a who? it was all about the soda scott, i never saw the damn movie. i knew there was a kid with a mushroom hair cut and a guy who was like satan but really... i was too hopped up on caffine to watch anything.
<currently wondering what it would look like if all of scotts action figures were melted into a giant blob of plastic>
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Post by Brandon on May 3, 2006 20:56:41 GMT -5
I have to agree with you on a lot of those points, Scott. I really liked Sith (overlooking some things... like, the acting!) The high points throughout were definately the lightsaber duels, Obi-Wan, and Palpatine. The story points of Phantom Menace could have been taken care in a short prologue to Attack of the Clones and allowed the story to kick into high gear! That's part of what I missed. The original tirlogy jumped from point to point at breakneck speed and every minute had you on the edge of you seat. The second one had me looking at my watch a few times. The whole Clones thing was weird to me. Why not just have regular guys? What about the officers? I really hope this is all looked at more closely in the TV show. I liked AOTC better but really didn't feel like the Jedi should have been so cluely about Sidious. Christopher Lee frickin' TOLD Obi-Wan Sidious was in control of the Senate! Ah, the Dark Side clouds every thing though. And apparently whatever the Jedis were smoking as well. Ha. Sith worked for me and really helped grab back a little of that original magic. I just really wish at the end we'd seen more Vader action. It only made me resent Menace that much more. As far as the Explanded Universe, I've only ever read one novel and that was Splinter of the Mind's Eye. Yeah I know, it's been awhile. I absolutely loved Clone Wars! A little overboard on Jedi powers but hey, it was cool. I've only played a few of the video games but really enjoyed Knights of the Old Republic. Then there's the Holiday Special. I don't know if you've ever seen it Scott, but it's a truly mind-blowing spectacle. On one hand it had the cool animation that introduced Boba Fett in the SW universe and the entire original cast. On the other hand, it was a horribly wretched story with cameos by Bea Arthur, Harvey Korman, Art Carney, and Jefferson Starship. Oh. My. God. Your collection is mind-boggling! An original Death Star playset!! Aw man. Very cool stuff, Scott! Of my original SW collection I only have a few things left. A long story that makes me sad to this very day. My collection now consists of famous robots from various media. I have old tin wind-up replicas (Gort!), original droids from SW, Conky from Pee-Wee's Playhouse, some Gundams, Voltron, Ultron, Shogun Warriors (my personal favorites!), a little Johhny Five lookalike, Bender, and so on. I'll try to do up a pic soon to share. |
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Post by brigante133 on May 3, 2006 21:10:05 GMT -5
I dont collect much toys but my grandpa was a pretty big star wars fan and I have a really cool darth vader helmet from the seventies that i have to keep high on my bookshelf so kids don't touch it when they come over. other than that i got a really big Eddie from iron maiden figure, the entire mcfarlane Kiss Alive and Metallica sets... and Oscar Wildes action figure. the last is a must have.
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Post by starlord on May 3, 2006 21:33:37 GMT -5
Well before I reflect, let me just say, WHOA, SCOTT!!! Thanks for the pictures. It makes my hobbies look docile in comparison. Great stuff, though!!!
I was eleven when A New Hope came out and went with my aunt, who is also my best friend, second mom, and big sister, all rolled into one. I was stunned! Awed! It was the greatest thing I had ever seen. I went over and over and over again, to see it. I knew then that there would be no greater movie hero for me, then Han Solo. I later learned that Indy would run a very close second.
A few years later came Empire Strikes Back. Personally this one still holds as my all time favorite. Talk about break neck speed. And a muppet as the Jedi guru! The big revelation (didn't see it coming, but who did) and the cliffhanger!!! I love cliffhangers.
Next up ROTJ. Opening day, sunny and blue sky's. My D & D buddies and I hanging out, telling lame jokes and waiting for the conclusion. Although I am not a fan of the Ewoks, at all. This movie had my favorite action sequence of any of the movies. The battle on (I'm going to spell this wrong) Tatooine. Best line. "How we doing?" "Same as usual." "That bad, huh." Not the actual lines, I know, but whatever the lines were, are still my favorite. Great movie. I was fulfilled.
What! More movies on the way?! Yes! and that was the last time I was excited before a Star Wars movie. Phantom Menace just sucked. (except for the lightsaber scene at the end). There was nothing about this movie that I liked. And I kept wondering why Jar Jar looked a lot like Lily Tomlin. He does, check it out. I watched that movie twice, bought it, and put it on a shelf. To this day it has never been opened.
Another one? Yeah, ok, whatever. Hey, not to bad. I mean sure, we have leads that can't act their way out of a paper bag, at least in this movie, but the creation of the stormtroopers. The final shot of the first class of star destroyers as the troops board, and Yoda's battle. This wasn't to bad, after you get past the first hour. Okay, I'm kind of looking forward to the third one.
Sith: Hallelujah, Lucas finally woke up!!! Still can't stand Hayden or Natalie. Never bought the love story at all. But the action, the effects, even the plot, were finally up where they belonged. But what was the greatest part of Sith, to me, was Ewan McGregor. he was awesome! His mannerisms, his speech, everything was perfect as a young Obi Wan. Sir Guiness would have been proud. Still, it's kind of sad when the best two actors in the movie are the second lead and a digital three foot Jedi from Degabah.
Unfortunatley I never saw the animated stuff. Is that on DVD yet, by any chance?
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 3, 2006 22:11:39 GMT -5
Yes! And you must go out and buy it tonight! Stop your internet browsing & go!  Clones Wars Volume 1 & 2... Primo stuff! |
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 3, 2006 22:17:17 GMT -5
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Post by Brandon on May 4, 2006 7:36:39 GMT -5
YAY!!!! Han will shoot first once again!
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Post by batarang on May 4, 2006 9:57:24 GMT -5
Isn't it amazing the appeal this series has across generations? Those of us who were around for the original trilogy in the theaters (and drive-ins, in my case) can remember what a PHENOMENON Star Wars was. I watched the Holiday Special when it aired the one and only time and I still remember it vividly, that's how much of an impression these movies made on me. I had most of the original toys (all since lost or destroyed, I think the Death Star got 'em).
I was so excited for the new trilogy and I have to say that though I still enjoy them there seems to be something missing, some element of magic the original one had. ESPECIALLY Episode I. I actually yelled out in the theater "I can't believe this sucks!" (which is something I would never do ordinarily, and I can't stand people who do that). II and especially III were vast improvements but I have huge problems with those also (but if you want to nit-pick about plot holes you could fill an encyclopedia).
But my kids like the new trilogy better, so what do I know.
Scott, that is an UNBELIEVABLE collection. I thought I was a fan but... I'm jealous
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Post by darkknightdetec on May 4, 2006 13:36:22 GMT -5
I was a Star Wars fan before I was a fan of anything else. I used to love to collect the figures. I've seen EPISODE IV so many times that I could probably recite the first half of the movie.
C-3P0: Did you hear that?
R2-D2: <beeps>
C-3P0: They've shut down the main reactor! We'll be destroyed for sure! This is madness!
R2-D2: <beeps>
...okay, I won't do it all, but I've seen it a lot of times.
I know many will agree with me when I say the new movies aren't up to the quality of the older ones (but they're still good).
I have a good idea! Let's put all 6 movies in order from favorite to least favorite (opinions, of course)!
Mine are:
1. EPISODE IV: A NEW HOPE
2. EPISODE VI: RETURN OF THE JEDI
3. EPISODE V: THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK
4. EPISODE III: REVENGE OF THE SITH
5. EPISODE II: ATTACK OF THE CLONES
6. EPISODE I: THE PHANTOM MENACE
I just thought THE PHANTOM MENACE was a bit boring at times, and didn't seem as exciting as the others and the story isn't quite as good. My biggest gripe with ATTACK OF THE CLONES was that it turned into too much of a love story, and I don't think STAR WARS should focus that much on a relationship. Revenge of the Sith was definately the best of the new movies, and it's the one I think is closest to the older ones.
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Post by hope on May 4, 2006 21:49:44 GMT -5
I actually thought the Revenge of the Sith was pretty good.
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 4, 2006 22:21:41 GMT -5
For me it's:
1. Empire Strikes Back
2. Return of the Jedi
3. Revenge of the Sith
4. A New Hope
5. The Phantom Menace
6. Attack of the Clones
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Post by Brandon on May 4, 2006 22:35:27 GMT -5
For me it would be...
1. A New Hope
2. Empire Strikes Back
3. Revenge of the Sith
4. Return of the Jedi
5. Attack of the Clones
6. The Phantom Menace
New Hope is just the one for me. I know it's not the strongest story and acting and all, but it's just pure Star Wars for me.
I was thinking Scott how many connections there are between Star Wars and the Green Lantern Corps. It's kind of a natural fit and one a lot of people have picked up on (one of the coolest being Darth Lantern's amalgams), but there is a direct link between the two also. Both apparently drew inspiration from the old Lensman series of books. Apparently the good guys in that were named the Arisia. That of course who the female Green Lantern is named for in the comics, but there is also a rumor that in an early version of the SW script by George Lucas he used the term Arisia instead of The Force!
I've actually got one of the early Lensman books but had trouble getting into it. I'm going to give it another try when I get finished with the book I'm reading now.
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 4, 2006 22:41:06 GMT -5
Yeah, figures they'd both be my favorites!
Interesting, I had no idea... I'll have to look them up!
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Post by Brandon on May 5, 2006 1:34:05 GMT -5
You should definately see the Clone Wars cartoons, Brian! They added so much to what I felt had been missing from the movies at that point. They really capture the true SW feel and are just darn cool!
Jar Jar and Lily Tomlin.... weeeeiiiirrrd.
When I went to Celebration 3 they did movie marathons a couple of nights and my cousin and I went for the Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones night. It was crazy during Phantom Menace, people were making cracks at the screen like it was the Rocky Horror Picture Show. There wasn't a single appearance of Jar Jar on screen where a negative comment wasn't made by someone in the audience.
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Post by brigante133 on May 5, 2006 10:19:42 GMT -5
1. Empire strikes back
2. Return of the Jedi
3. New Hope
4. Menace, the Phantom one.
5. Attack of the Clones
As you can see, I put Clones beneath Menace because honestly, if I wanted to watch really depressing youths whine about how their life sucks and try to act hardcore by wearing dark colors, i would go to school and see it for free. To me it had no redeeming value and the phrase, "who da man? Yoda man!" gave me severe headaches. Because of that I did not see the last one, my life has no void for not knowing what happened and I could care less that Vader got chopped up. my brothers did rent it and i saw the ending. "nooooooo"? C'mon Vader, you shoulda went Cujo on his ass, not whine even more then you did prior to being cut up and tossed in lava.... little sissy. He makes the Ewoks loook like those crazy Wampa things that Luke cut up.
Also, Menace had pod racing. It was like I was watching Ben Hur all over again sans jesus and lepers but WITH aliens and explosions, two things that clearly would have elevated it. Imagine Ben Hur on that ship and he pulls out a lightsaber and takes to them. A+ stuff there.
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Post by Lantern Lad on May 6, 2006 8:46:45 GMT -5
You know what would be cool...
George Lucas considers himself to be a technological innovator, why not try something experimental? How about a 'choose your own adventure' version of Star Wars! It wouldn't be something that a casual fan of the original trilogy would be interested in, but for those of us that are pretty hardcore, it could be amazing! Here's the premise:
Before hitting play on the DVD, you follow a series of menus. You choose which scenes from which version of the film you want to see on your 'Ultimate' Star Wars. For example:
Episode IV: A New Hope: Keep all of the 'Special Edition' enhancements until you get to Mos Eisley, then switch to the original version. Switch back to the special edition for the far superior attack on the Death Star at the end.
Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back: Not much wrong with the Special Edition of this that I can remember aside from a few changes lines that I never understood: Luke to R2 on Dagobah: 'You're lucky you don't taste very good!' (never understand why that was altered); And Vader seething with anger on Bespin, growling to his subbordinate: "Brring me my Ship!" (Instead of, 'tell the commander to prepare my shuttle for my arrival' or whatever he says in the SE). Otherwise, I loved the addition of Ian as Palpatine in the hologram sequence and luckily on the DVD version Luke no longer screams when he willingly plummets down the shaft on Bespin!
Episode VI: Return of the Jedi: Only problem I have with this one really is the end. I prefer Sebastian Shaw as Anakin over Hayden. I prefer the original Ewok celebration song over the collage of scenes mixed with the pan flute music.
OK, once you've selected your version of Star Wars, you have two options: Permanently save your changes/or watch now, make a different version later!
Boom, you've got the ultimate edition of Star Wars at your fingertips! One where Han shoots first and you can see a Wampa munchin' down on some Tauntaun.
The technology, I'm sure exists somewhere... Opinions?
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Post by starlord on May 6, 2006 13:28:23 GMT -5
That's a cool idea, Scott. The whole thing with Han really grinds my butt! Let the man shoot first! Anyway, my order goes as follows. 1. Empire Strikes Back 2. A New Hope 3. Return of the Jedi 4. Revenge of the Sith 5. Attack of the Clones 6. The Phantom Menace And although I have to agree with you, Ramon, on the whiney kids thing, it still doesn't compare to the bogged down, needless set up and all around Jar Jar stink fest. |
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Post by HoM on May 6, 2006 15:52:52 GMT -5
Empire Strikes Back
Return of the Jedi
Revenge of the Sith
Attack of the Clones
A New Hope
Phantom Menace
Empire ruled. My favourite of the trilogy.
Return because it tied everything up nicely. *mumbles*
Revenge because it tied ever- wait, no...
Attack because of the massive lightsaber battle. So freaking awesome.
Hope because it didn't deserve to go below Phantom.
Phantom because Liam Neeson died. Maul was AWESOME!
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Post by starlord on May 6, 2006 21:22:19 GMT -5
I'm really surprised how far down on the lists that A New Hope is for some of you. Although not my favorite, it's still The Star Wars. The one where it all began. It's like the first time you see a magic trick that blows you away. It's not my number one either, but there's no way I could put it any lower then two. I still remember that sense of awe as I watched the underside of that Star Destroyer come onto the screen for the first time. Nothing has topped that moment for me. Geez, now I wish I could go back in time and relive that moment. *sigh* Where's Roy? I need to commiserate.  |
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Post by Admin on May 6, 2006 21:33:05 GMT -5
1. Empire
2. A New Hope
3. Return of the Jedi
4. Revenge of the Sith
5. Phantom Menace
6. Steaming Pile of Poo-Doo (otherwise known as Attack of the Clones)
No contest that Empire is the best, and as good as Jedi is, for me the original (A New Hope) is better. None of the sequels measure up in my estimation. But of all of them, Sith was least disappointing, and it's a tie for last place between Phantom Menace and Clones, with the edge going to PM for the best light saber duel in the history of the franchise. I can think of nothing redeeming about Clones, personally; the love story was trite, the dialogue atrocious, and even Yoda's duel was farcical.
All of that being said, I can't deny that all six movies are examples of exceptional fimmaking.
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Post by batarang on May 7, 2006 0:24:31 GMT -5
1. Empire
2. Hope
3. Jedi
4. Sith
5. Clones
6. Menace
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Post by Brandon on May 7, 2006 16:03:59 GMT -5
Is that a lightsaber in your pocket, or...  Yes. It's wrong. I know. There's no accounting for tastes among those degenerate lowbrow artist-types. So if Luke really had turned to the Dark Side, do you think his Sith name would have been Darth Sisterkisser? Darth Cest? Something else? I guess we'll never know. |
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Post by starlord on May 7, 2006 16:40:18 GMT -5
hmmm, maybe, Darth Mauldissister.
*groan*
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movies & Star Trek movies 
followed... but alas no Star Wars 
!
